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Welcome back to the Word on Fire Show. I'm Matthew Petrusek, senior director of the Word on Fire Institute and the host of the Word on Fire Show. Thank you for joining us. The evolutionary behavioral scientist and public intellectual Gad Saad recently published an influential book entitled Suicidal Empathy: Dying to Be Kind. In it, Saad argues that much of the West has, unfortunately, come to embrace a perversely deficient understanding of empathy, twisting the natural and otherwise noble human capacity to feel and respond to other peoples' sufferings into a moral license to upend the moral, economic, and political order. According to the dictates of suicidal empathy, for example, society should prioritize criminals over victims, illegal immigrants over citizens, lawbreakers over law abiders, racial identity over competence, adult sexual expression over childhood innocence, and trans women––that is, men pretending to be women––over real women. Suicidal empathy's endgame, Saad warns, is nothing less than societal ruin and the eventual totalitarian eclipse of the individual. How, from a Catholic perspective, should we assess these claims? Is Saad's characterization of suicidal empathy and its dangers accurate? If so, how should we, as Christians, constructively respond? What role, in particular, should the biblical conception of love play in defining what it means to show true compassion and care for those in need? Here to discuss Saad's book and to explain how authentic Christian charity is—and is not—related to empathy, is Bishop Robert Barron. Topics Covered 00:00 | Introduction 01:40 | Bishop Barron interviews JD Vance 02:45 | How Saad defines "empathy" 04:45 | Saad's argument on the exaggeration of empathy 06:31 | Exploring the concept of "forbidden knowledge" 09:30 | "It will destroy the West"? 11:05 | Connecting wokeism and self-destructive empathy 12:33 | Can we square wokeism's moralizing mandates with its amoral claims? 13:40 | Tracing the movement's origins 16:27 | Mistaking empathy for love 22:01 | Recognizing the fallenness of our emotional lives 27:39 | Does love equate to niceness and kindness? 28:50 | What about "love thy neighbor"? 30:42 | Distinguishing a proper preference for the poor from its unhealthy overemphasis 32:46 | Addressing the Christian impulse beneath the wokeist trappings 34:42 | Listener question: Where was God before time? 36:33 | Join the Word on Fire Institute Links: <ul> <li> Word on Fire Institute: <a href= "https://institute.wordonfire.org/" target="_blank" rel= "noopener noreferrer nofollow">https://institute.wordonfire.org/</a> </li> </ul> NOTE: Do you like this podcast? <a href= "https://www.wordonfire.org/ignite-wof-show" target="_blank" rel= "noopener noreferrer nofollow">Become a Word on Fire IGNITE member</a>! Word on Fire is a non-profit ministry that depends on the support of our listeners . . . like you! So become a part of this mission and <a href= "https://www.wordonfire.org/ignite-wof-show" target="_blank" rel= "noopener noreferrer nofollow">join IGNITE today</a> to become a Word on Fire insider and receive some special donor gifts for your generosity.